reCHARGE® Your Life

Ep42: Phil Strazzulla reCHARGED

September 29, 2021 Dr. Keri Ohlrich & Kelly Guenther
reCHARGE® Your Life
Ep42: Phil Strazzulla reCHARGED
Show Notes Transcript

Phil Strazzulla starts off providing a few great ideas to help us focus on self care and make time for creativity. He continues to tell us the decision he made that changed the trajectory of his life: Middle school wrestling. Yep, you read that right! Trying out for a sport that he wasn’t good at and failing at it for a couple years changed his life. 

Phil tells us that he was a shy, skinny kid and he knew he wanted to boost his confidence and thought wrestling could help him. He wasn’t good at wrestling but also wasn’t a quitter so he pushed forward. Then Freshman year he started winning and he worked even harder. 

This confidence boost helped him throughout his career as well as his hard work. He reminds us that being resilient and working hard even when you may not think you have the talent or are told you have talent is one of the keys to success. We all need to work hard. 

His coaching to others: Think outside of yourself and be a third party especially during high emotional situations. Don’t take every piece of advice you hear. And, most importantly, believe in yourself. 

Phil  is a former venture investor turned HR Tech entrepreneur. He is the Founder of SelectSoftware Reviews, a website dedicated to helping HR professionals buy the right tools. He has an MBA from Harvard Business School and is a self -taught programmer.

Connect with Phil to learn more about him and his background:

Sign up for our newsletter at https://abbraccigroup.com/. Please subscribe, leave a review and tell your friends about our podcast. Learn more about the CHARGE® model by purchasing the book, The Way of the HR Warrior. Let us know about the moments for you that changed your life trajectory. Drop us a note via our website. 

Keri [00:00:12] Welcome to the reCHARGE®, Your Life podcast with me, Dr. Keri Ohlrich and Kelly Guenther, we are thrilled to talk to people who have made a decision that reCHARGE® their lives often. They push themselves out of their comfort zones and took risks. We want to know about that decision point. Why did they make that decision? And most importantly, how can we learn from them? Kelly and I are passionate HR professionals, and together we co-founded our HR consulting firm Abbracci Group. We have talked to amazing people throughout our careers and listen to them as they made decisions that changed their lives and knew that these inspirational stories would help others. And why did we call it reCHARGE®? It's based on a book I coauthored called The Way of the HR Warrior. And in it we have a leadership model CHARGE which stands for courage, humility, accuracy, resiliency, goal oriented and exemplary. We know that people used one or more of these qualities to help them make their decisions, and we want to learn from them. Now sit back, listen and be inspired by these stories and then do something to reCHARGE® your life. Let's get to it. 

Kelly [00:01:18] Hi, everyone. It's Kelly. We're thrilled to have Phil Strazzulla as our special guest. Phil is a former venture investor turned to HR tech entrepreneur. He's the founder of Select Software Reviews, a website dedicated to helping HR professionals buy the right tools. He has an MBA from Harvard Business School and is a self-taught programmer. So, Phil, thanks so much for being on our podcast. We always like to start by asking what show, podcast, book or blog do you go to when you want to push yourself and expand your thinking? 

Phil [00:01:48] Sure. Thanks for having me on. I'm looking for the conversation. I have noticed in my life that some of my best ideas come from a combination of listening to a podcast that I love and working out at the same time I have. Constantly just sort of like stop my workout and write myself notes of stuff that I need to do to make progress on whatever goal it is, professional or personal. And the podcast that I do this the most with is called Invest Like the Best with this guy, Patrick O'Shaughnessy. And he interviews really famous investors, hedge fund managers, private equity, venture capital, as well as really accomplished entrepreneurs. And it's sort of like a weird group of people, I guess, but it's sort of like a little bit I feel like my tribe, like I've been investing in the stock market since I was 12 and started a company. And whenever I listen to that and do a workout at the same time, I just get all these ideas. Some of them are terrible. And that's why I write them down and I imagine to myself so I can look at them in the future. But some of them are actually really great and actually sort of game changing. And so for whatever reason and I know for some people talking, walking, for some people it's running whatever, I just like really find myself reCHARGE® and think really well with that combo. 

Keri [00:03:12] Welcome, Phil, thank you. And we talked to Phil earlier before we started recording, he's going to be a new dad. So congratulations. We're very excited and it's coming February as we learned is the year of the Golden Tiger. It's a very, very, very auspicious way to start the year. So I. I was thinking, Phil, when you were saying that it's like, you know, there's the joke that you have all these good ideas in the shower because your mind is kind of clear. You're not really thinking, I think your workouts kind of the same way. So you can cleaning your mind, you're clearing the cobwebs out. You're you're making space while you're working out. And then you listen to this podcast and invest like the best. Tell me some of your tell me one. I would love this if you can think about one horrible idea, because you said some of them are horrible. So I love to listen to, like, a funny, horrible idea. But then what's some of your game changing ideas that you've had by listening to this podcast and working out? 

Phil [00:04:13] Sure. So a lot of these are really boring and specific for. My sort of world, and so I'm literally now opening up the the label of my Gmail called 'B ideas', the ideas instead of business ideas, because some of them are just bad ideas or actual business ideas. So one of these ideas is that no entrepreneur thinks rationally about their personal portfolio. So you've got the money in the bank money and stock market, and most of your net worth is in this company. And I think there's like an opportunity to provide liquidity for those folks, to give them diversification while still allowing for lots of upside into the business. The downside of this is your board is going to throw up on it because they don't want you to have diversification. They want you to be all in on a given idea. And so you can probably structure it in a way that provides for some short term cash flow, plus a bunch of stuff that you get in the future while still drinking. So that's the sort of weird, esoteric idea that, like nobody else cares about that comes to me while I'm doing these workouts. Others actually can be like a lot more useful and generalizable. Like, for example, the the closing question that this host likes to ask is what is the nicest thing anyone's ever done for you? And so there's a lot of, like, really cool stories that come out of that. And I think as sort of broad idea for me is just that, like even though for whatever reason, my brain has always gravitated towards business and investing and like all this stuff, the reality is that the majority of your life and happiness and your experience in the world comes from stuff outside of that. And so it's really important to be kind to other people to enjoy moments versus looking at your phone or thinking in the back of your head about all the emails that you have to write. And so I actually wrote a MailChimp cadence to myself of like the 30 or 40 ideas that relate to work life balance that I really want to keep top of mind that are just like really hard to do on a day to day basis. And I you know, every couple of months I subscribe to that cadence and I get an email per day and I'm like, oh, yeah, that's a good exercise. Like I should call a friend that I haven't talked to in six months. So that's probably one of the better ideas that's come out of it. 

Keri [00:06:47] Yeah. So you just hit me because we love to talk about action on this podcast, Bill, and advice for people. So you set up your MailChimp to send you an email every day for, what, 30 days to give you some ideas on work life balance? 

Phil [00:07:01] Exactly, so I just it was a Saturday morning raining up here in Boston, many times we get bad weather and I get free time to do random projects. And I said, you know what? Like, there are all these ideas that, like, are really hard to internalize in the the chaos of everyday life. And so I just wrote one idea per email and put them into a sequence. And MailChimp, which I use for my business, and I just added myself. So each day I get a note that's like, hey, Phil, one of the things you're trying to work on is, I don't know, cutting down on caffeine like today should only have one cup of coffee or do something nice for your significant other or whatever the case may be. And sometimes you just need a little bit of push. 

Keri [00:07:47] I, I we were talking yesterday with someone about just setting little tiny goals and how important that is that just like you said, just not having an extra cup of coffee or doing something just nice or calling a friend or just dropping a note to someone which maybe only takes five minutes. But it really does make a significant difference in someone's life and yours, because you get that kind of endorphin rush of helping and doing something nice, what you feel. What's your favorite thing this week or something for work life balance? What kind of is is on your is on your brain that you're like? This is what I'm trying to do.  

Phil [00:08:25] So one of the cheat codes I think that I've picked up and I think I stole this from Tim Ferriss is if you give somebody like a huge tip, you feel so good about yourself. And and so there's there's this guy that is extremely handicapped, that sells bottles of water on Newbury Street in Boston, which is like the big shopping district. And he's just in his wheelchair. He's nonverbal. He's probably in his 70s. And I've actually seen him. I think he lives quite close to my neighborhood and I've seen him getting around and stuff and he sells these bottles of water. And I just gave him 20 bucks for one of the bottles. And he saw that. And he he was like very, very emotional. And I almost kind of almost feel selfish doing this, but I felt really good about doing that. And that 20 bucks doesn't matter as much to me for sure. And so that was one of the things that I did this weekend. And you can give somebody one hundred percent tip when they give you a cup of coffee or give somebody a 40 percent tip if they do a great job as a waiter, whatever the case may be like, that's such an easy way to feel good about yourself. 

Keri [00:09:39] I like what you said because I've said that as well as what's this extra dollar or two dollars or three dollars? And sometimes it does make a difference. Back when I was in college, that was my lunch money. Right. So that was two dollars was a big deal. So I don't want to discount that that people that is a big deal. But when you get to a certain stage, sometimes it's not. And you're like, really that extra five dollars means so much to this other person. And that is not as much to me. And like you said, the endorphin rush, the bump that you get and feeling good and it puts you in a good mood for the rest of the day. So thank you for sharing that. Appreciate that. So now the big question is, what is the decision that you made that change the trajectory of your life? And what are some of those charged qualities that you use to help you make that decision? 

Phil [00:10:29] Sure. So I think that, to be quite honest, that I've been debating this, I'll be honest, when you guys told me the question was and I think the biggest decision for me was to go out for the wrestling team when I was in middle school, it I was extremely shy, even though I'm a Scorpio and very shy, like 80 pound super skinny kid. And I always like playing sports, you know, baseball, soccer, whatever. I was never very good at any of them, but I just didn't have a lot of self-confidence. And my mother had heard that there was like this really good, like new wrestling coach for the middle school team. And she encouraged me to go out for it. And I was in the gymnasium and there were some assembly. And then you were supposed to go to one corner, the if you're going to hockey, one quarter on wrestling, etc.. And I was my heart was like beating out of its chest. And I remember I was thinking, I'm just walking out of here and I'm going home. I'm not going to do this. And I saw this kid who I won't name this person, but he was a little bit smaller than me and he was walking towards wrestling. I was like, if he can do it, I can do it. And I did it. And it really changed the trajectory of my life. I wasn't very good the first couple of years, but I for whatever reason, the bug bit me and I got really into it. I ended up winning the state championship my senior year and it gave me a lot of confidence. And I you know, I still, I think, took that confidence to do well in college, get a job, work through a layoff in twenty eight when I was right out of college and still get into a business school and start a company and all that stuff. So I think that's really the thing that that changed things for me personally. 

Keri [00:12:18] I first of all, thank you. I love that when we ask this question, I love that you went way back because sometimes those are the ones like you're in middle school and you like either you make the team, you don't make the team. And whatever that is really does change the way you look at yourself and does change the trajectory of your life. So thank you for going all the way back. So let's talk about. So Mom. So Mom says here's this is kind of wrestling coach. Were you open to the idea at first fell or were you like, I'm not going to do this at all? Even before you got there? I know when you got there, you were going to kind of walk away. But even getting there, how did convince you or how did you say, all right, I'll try this? 

Phil [00:12:59] I think I've always been a really open minded person and somebody who's always trying to get better at stuff, and I logically realize that, yeah, I'm like this skinny, you know, a very shy person. I would benefit from something that's really hard and maybe would give me some muscles and stuff like that so I could stand up for myself. And so I think I was open to it. And then, of course, it came from a source that I had a lot of trust and I knew was sort of on my side. And it wasn't it wasn't a pressure thing. It wasn't like you're going out for the wrestling team. And that's that. It was more like, here's something you should really consider, because it will have this potential benefit. And the hardest part of it, just like the hardest part of a lot of things, was just getting started. And once you're on the team like, I'm not going to quit the team right now, I'm probably going to do it the next year. And then I start getting a little bit better. And, you know, people are like, hey, maybe you can make the varsity team when you're in high school and then you make it and you kind of go down this progression. But, yeah, it was more just thinking about it rationally, despite the emotional response to run. 

Keri [00:14:13] Yeah. So what were you, six, seventh or eighth grade? What, what middle school year. 

Phil [00:14:19] Seventh. 

Keri [00:14:20] Sorry. So so I have to say you're quite an open minded kid and a self-aware kid like where did this self-awareness come from? Because you're like, you know what, let me rationally look at the most. Seventh graders aren't as rational as that feel. So it's like, let me rationally look at this. I'm skinny. I need to boost my confidence. This would be a good idea. Like where did that come from? Did you come out of the womb filled with like a pro/con list? So I need to understand where the self-awareness and this rational come from. 

Phil [00:14:50] That's a great question. I have been journaling since like fifth grade, and so I think yeah, and part of that is, again, being encouraged by parent and part of that's probably like some sort of natural natural proclivity or is it and a bit of luck. So I think probably there is like a nature nurture component to it. But I was probably a slightly more mature kid than most. Like I I'm the oldest of four. When I was 10, I would babysit my siblings and my youngest sibling is extremely handicapped. And so it was a fairly hard thing to do. When I was 12, I opened up a brokerage account to trade stocks like I was just always maybe interested in different stuff. Yeah. 

Keri [00:15:42] Wow. So I have such a reflective person. Like, that's what I just I just took a note. Feel like you're so reflective at such a young age. Being the oldest sometimes make you makes you a little bit more mature, especially when you have to take care of siblings, regardless of if they're handicapped or not. But it makes you a little bit more mature. But it was in you to be that reflective and start that brokerage account. So so now you said to you a couple of years to kind of get good at it, how that's pretty resilient. So how did you kind of talk yourself through? OK, I might want to quit because it is really hard and I'm not seeing the results right away. Like, how did you manage yourself through that? Again, such a young age. It's so impressive, Phil. 

Phil [00:16:30] Thanks. I think the idea of quitting stuff just never really was high on the radar screen, I guess. And so the first couple of years it was just, oh, I'm going to do wrestling. And then I'm somebody that I think, like latches on to bits of praise and thinks, oh, that that could be true. And I'm sure the coaches were telling every kid, hey, you could be you could win this tournament, you could be on varsity, you could do this, this and this. And I was thinking probably somebody said that to me once when I was in eighth grade. And I thought, wow, that that that could be me, you know, and I get there. Well, I got to work really hard. I got to lift weights. I got to eat right and make sure I'm on weight and all these other things. And then sometime around my freshman year, I just sort of got addicted to the adrenaline of, like, beating somebody. Yeah. A match. And and I thought, wow, this feels really good. And so how do I get more of this? You start training, you start saving up and go into wrestling camps in different states and tournaments and start watching videos on the Internet to try to learn from Russian wrestlers and all this other stuff. So it just sort of put me on a path, 

Keri [00:17:55] Yeah, what what did you when you talked about building your confidence? How did that manifest? Like how did you start to see that? Because you are so reflective. I'm sure you journaled about it. So how how did you start to see that confidence play out as you were getting older and then in high school? 

Phil [00:18:12] I think it's been a really slow progression. Like many things, I was actually thinking about this yesterday because somebody was comparing my fiance and I, and she's a very introverted person. I'm a slightly more extroverted person. And I think I started off as an extremely introverted person. I probably talked to one kid in preschool sort of thing. And it's just been a really long, slow progression. And I think that's the same with the self-confidence where I probably started off in the 10th percentile and just very, very, very slowly gained it as I practiced stuff and then achieved something and realized I could do more and more. And I think that the way it's manifests itself is when you start to achieve something, you're. The horizons for what are is accomplishable expands a lot, and so from a wrestling perspective, like maybe you get on the varsity team and you're like, hey, I could have a better than five hundred record, or maybe I could next year qualify for the state tournament. Maybe I can win a match. Maybe you could place this HR. Maybe I could win the state tournament sort of thing. And I think it's the same for professional sort of things for sure. When I was in college, I remember I took the GMAT and I did really well on it. And I looked it up and I said, jeez, if I applied to business school, I would be in the top quartile for kids to get into Harvard Business School. And I said, I'll never get into Harvard Business School. That's ridiculous. But, you know, that's kind of cool that at least on this one metric, I'm on that level. And then a few years later, I found myself matriculating there because I had continued to just accomplish more and more stuff. I believe in myself more and more. So it's been it's been a really slow progression, but it's been steady progress every single year. And it's sort of that whole compound interest. If you get one percent better every week, that adds up hugely over the course of years and decades. 

Keri [00:20:11] I really appreciate that. That's that slow burn. And again, you didn't expect an instant result. And you're like every day, every week I'm getting better. And you did get this. It was a good feedback loop you're getting to because you're getting better and you maybe won another match or you got some more praise and then you're like, all right. And that's going to build my confidence a little bit more. But I really appreciate what you said, Phil, is you didn't start off this way. So I think we've been talking lately with a few people about the people. As you get older, people might think, oh, Phil's life is really easy. He's always been super successful or started his own business or look at him. He's extroverted. He's on a podcast. And it's really good to for people to understand, like, no, I wasn't that way. And I've really worked at it to try to push myself to become more confident and become a little more extroverted because of X, Y and Z reasons. I wanted to do that. So I really appreciate you sharing that. 

Phil [00:21:09] So, yeah, of course. One little anecdote just to support that is I remember in middle school on the wrestling team, we had a pretty good middle school wrestling team and I was probably the worst person on it. I had a losing record. I was just not good. I was too timid. I wasn't strong enough. And there were like six or seven kids who legitimately, like the coaches, actually thought could be really good in high school. And they were all talking about winning state championships and all this stuff. And I was like, oh, man. I was like, well, at least I'll get to be on a team with these guys when they're real good, when our seniors in five or six years. And the ironic thing is that, you know, each of those people sort of peaked then and they they didn't keep getting better. And I was the only one that that actually accomplished that sort of goal. And so even if you're starting in the, you know, bottom 10 percent and you seem really hopeless, a lot of people aren't going to have the focus to keep getting better and to do the things you need to do to to make it to that next level. And so if you're if you're starting in one place, you don't need to be discouraged because over the course of time, hard work and focus will pay off in a big way. 

Keri [00:22:23] Yeah. Yeah. So the what is it the the hare and the turtle. Right. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Because but you're you're so right. And we were talking, we were, I was of course giving unsolicited advice to people about children because that's what happens when you're having a new baby. Everyone tells you their advice whether you want it or not. But but that I remember one of the teachers. You said something really profound, Phil, is that sometimes when you start off kind of at the top, it's so much harder to practice and focus. And I remember some of the teachers saying when the kids when some kids who start off kind of smart and things come easy for them or sports wise. So I start off at sports. I played football and it was really easy for me. At some point it becomes hard. And if you don't have that skill of having to practice, because maybe I didn't start off in the top spot, it's really hard for them sometimes to make that switch because they start to internalize it like, well, I was really good, why am I not good right now? And so, in a way, you didn't, you know, for wrestling, you didn't start off that way. You didn't have that preconceived notion of, like, I'm a really damn good wrestler and it came naturally for you. And so you had to work at it. And so you didn't have that kind of that B.S. that can that can get in your way thinking that, well, no, I'm naturally talented, so why do I have to work at it? And so you get that script, which is which is hard for some kids when things come naturally for them, it's harder to work at it. Does that make sense? 

Phil [00:23:57] It does. And it it's kind of funny. And this is sort of a different stratosphere, but really. To sports, if you look at the truly best athletes in different sports. Michael Jordan, Tom Brady, etc., and I'm a I'm a New England guy, so I'm a big Tom Brady fan. I know most people are not, but...

Keri [00:24:16] I love how all Tom Brady fans have to, like, put a little disclaimer right now. OK, OK, just please listen. He does work hard. I know you have issues with him, but like there he has an asterisk out of now. 

Phil [00:24:28] There is for sure. I think it's hard to dispute that he's the best football ever. And what's interesting is he came into the league. He was never really like the starter, like even in high school. Like, he was like good enough kind of to be the number one guy, like eventually same in college. And obviously that famous for being the one hundred and ninety nine draft pick in the NFL, somebody that could have been cut from the team. But I think because he he had enough talent, but he had to work really hard and, you know, in order to be truly the best, like the apex of the apex, like none of those people are getting there by talent, like there's nobody who's that good at football. You can be the best person on your high school team, but you're not going to even be the best person on your college team if you just rely on raw talent. And so it's those people who have a chip on their shoulder who figure out how to be really disciplined and keep getting better every single week that eventually get to the top of the heap. And you can see that across professional stuff, even things like comedy or magic or anything that's like very hard. And there's a lot to learn. 

Keri [00:25:45] Yeah, yeah. I appreciate that. Because you're right, Tom Brady people, again, you can project on to them that like. Oh, it was easy for them. No it wasn't. He almost got cut it like you said, he was one hundred and ninety nine pic like no one cared about him so really good. And he is really disciplined from what I've, what I've read about in practice and just editing and everything is super disciplined. What you've used so many of the charge qualities already fairly talked about. You had goals, resiliency, your, your humility to me when you're like, you know what, I don't have to be the best on wrestling. I'm just going to be on this team with all these great people. It has so much humility to it. What are some of the other, if any, additional ones of the charge qualities that you use that help you with your decisions? 

Phil [00:26:33] I think that some of the main ways that I think about decisions are just around. Trying to coach myself from a third party perspective, so there is this phrase looking at yourself from the balcony and we're all living some sort of narrative in our head and that makes us do usually irrational things, like, for example, maybe you feel scorned by your significant other because they didn't do the dishes and you have this narrative that they never do anything and blah, blah, blah. And that's why I'm going to be a jerk. Or maybe you have that relationship with a customer or your boss or whatever the case may be like. There's lots of different things and we're sort of programed to think that we're right. But if you can look at yourself from a third party perspective and try to be coachable, that can be a really powerful way to navigate, especially emotionally charged situations. And and keep an open mind, because at the end of the day, you you want to make you want to overcome your. Biology and make rational choices are a great example, is recently a family member of mine, we were doing an investment and we were buying some stock from somebody and the person that we're buying from did something a little bit shady. And she tried to increase the price. And my family member was like, I don't want to do this deal. This is ridiculous. This person's screwing us, et cetera. And that was a very irrational way of thinking about it. That was in an emotional way of thinking about something that really should just be purely economic, as it's still an interesting risk reward trade off. And the answer was yes. And so that person is much older than me. Came to me a few months later and said, thank you so much for helping me see that I was basically just being a big baby. And I'm glad that we actually bought it. We made a five and six months. Isn't that great? And I think that the people who can do that sort of thing for themselves, which is never easy and almost impossible to do, but if you can kind of start to go in that direction, it can be really powerful for any sort of decision making. And for me, you know, I try to do that and meditation definitely helps.  

Keri [00:29:07] Yeah, it was. I love that. Overcome your biology and make rational choices. I was listening to a podcast. They were talking about hot and cool and and and emotional states and how difficult it is to make those decisions at a hot, emotional state. And so the practicing, like you said, meditation, cooling yourself down, because in a cool state, we all make very rational decisions. That's not the problem. It's when you're in a hot state that how do you make that rational decision when you're in a hot state? And the only way you can do that is kind of be in a hot state or know how to calm yourself down when you're in that hot state by breathing or or counting to 10 or walking away from it. Something like that is is you have to get yourself into that cool state. What other fill? You already gave such wonderful advice. Do you have any other advice or actions for listeners as they're making decisions in their lives and making these choices?  

Phil [00:30:05] I think. My my other advice is to. Always take every other person's advice with a huge grain of salt. I was talking to a friend of mine last week who she's done a tremendous job in building a business to about a million dollars in revenue, selling a private label, skin cream. And she's, you know, should I raise venture capital? Should I sell the business? Should I do this? I knew that. And she'd gotten some advice from another person who basically said, hey, you should raise ten million dollars of venture capital money and you should try to make this billion dollar company. And for her, she was she was going to go down that path. But there was something about it that didn't sit well with her. And so her gut was telling her, hey, this is not the right thing to do. And even though the person who gave her that advice was extremely accomplished, that person was just projecting what had made them successful and hadn't really done much thinking about my friend's situation. And so I think that especially when you sit down with somebody has that confidence, who has that success, you have to be really careful because they might not be as careful when they are talking about your particular situation. And so it's always incumbent upon the decision maker to pass everything to understand how they're thinking and what they should do. What's different about the situation that maybe you're learning from through this person giving you advice? What's resonating with you? What is your gut sort of tell you? Because you've got to be really, really right in many ways that hard to understand but are true. And to just be careful, especially when the person talking to you is all of these. They're a billionaire. They sold their company for five hundred million dollars, or they're the sea level executive at this company that I want to be at or whatever. That doesn't mean that they're right. 

Keri [00:32:06] And it doesn't it doesn't mean that it's right for you, to your point felt listening to your gut. And I know that Kelly, like you, Kelly journaled, doesn't journalism much anymore, but journaled a lot. And I think that self that reflection and knowing what's in your gut so that when you're presented with that advice like, oh, you should have one hundred employees or you should be a billionaire or whatever. Well, that might not be for you. And so you got to listen to that voice. And it's very easy to get to to listen to the siren song and be like, well, everyone's on Shark Tank and everyone's getting the same money. Right? And that's what you should be. And that's our level of success. So I don't know, Kelly, with the journaling and listen to your gut and that reflection. I know you have some some thoughts on and Phil's beautiful advice and wonderful insights during this podcast.  

Kelly [00:32:58] Yeah, I think that's what resonates most with me is how the journey that you've taken. In terms of being a wrestler, it was about developing self-confidence, focusing your energy on what you wanted to pursue, setting goals for yourself, forging and developing relationships, making decisions, believing in yourself enough to achieve what you want, even if you thought to yourself, well, I don't know if it's a realistic possibility for me to go to Harvard Business School. You did. And you got your MBA. I have to believe that that helps make you even an even better consultant or adviser to the clients with whom you're talking with on a regular basis. Would I be right in saying that? 

Phil [00:33:40] I think so, yeah. And this is actually something that came up last week when I was talking to my friend because she had a very I could tell she was full. Her brain was full of cortisol. She had sort of this fear mentality when she was thinking about what to do next with her business. And I sort of was struck watching the Olympics by all of the Olympian, all the Olympians, confidence in themselves. There's nobody that gets up on the high dove or that swims in the pool or whatever that is not confident in themselves. And I think that's interesting because that basically means that people who are performing at the very highest levels and some of them might bordered on arrogance and some of them might not be rational decision makers about complex decisions and that mindset. But you do perform at a very a much higher level when you have the right amount of belief in yourself. And that allows you to think more clearly and just do the come up with. Not maybe the right solution, but a better solution. Mm hmm. 

Kelly [00:34:46] And I have to say, I grew up and being in high school, I had several cousins who were wrestlers. And wrestling is a very strategic sport. I mean, it's very difficult, very demanding, physically, very mental, because it's just you and your opponent on the mat and you have to you don't have...if you second guess yourself, you could wind up being pinned. 

Phil [00:35:07] Right. 

Kelly [00:35:07] So there are there are elements when I was just remembering some of those matches I would attend and how painful sometimes it was to see my cousins lose or how amazing it was to see them win because they they almost kind of found a part of themselves in other gear, if you will, that allowed them to drive their their confidence to the next level. So just an incredible story. And I think in our society, with instant gratification being something that we, you know, makes it certainly feel good in the short term. Your story emphasizes how with persistence and perseverance, you can really impact your own life and the lives of others in the long term. So thank you so much for sharing your story and for for being so candid with us on this on this podcast. We really encourage all of our viewers, all of our listeners, rather, to connect with you. You can check out the show notes in this episode for more information. And again, thank you for being on our podcast, for sharing your story. And congrats again to you and your spouse as you look forward to the birth of your baby next year. 

Phil [00:36:10] Thank you guys so much. And just my last comment for what you just said about finding another gear. I think the number one thing that the Harvard Business School MBA does is it allows people to believe in themselves because you have all these professors and they have all these CEOs come in and say, you can do whatever you want to do and somebody that comes in and maybe they never thought they could get a job at McKinsey. They apply for that job and they put a really they put a lot of effort into the cover letter and prepping and all these things because they believe that they can do it. And you everybody listening can find another gear if you believe that you can accomplish that goal. Thank you guys for having me on. 

Kelly [00:36:57] Thank you so much, Phil. And such great powerful words to to take us out. Thank you again for for being on our podcast. Thank you for listening to the reCHARGE® your Life podcast, please sign up for our newsletter at Abbracci Group.com. And follow us on social media. You can find us on LinkedIn at Abbracci Group, Instagram at WarriorsofHR and Twitter at Warriors_HR. Remember to subscribe to our podcast, leave a review and please tell a friend and be sure to drop us a note on how you are recharging your life. We can't wait to hear from you.